Why is it called Gerudo Desert? Why not Desert Colossus? Are there any Gerudo at all?
No, it might have been the remnants of the Gerudo Desert though. It seems this Gerudo Desert is much bigger than the Ocarina one, so maybe this is a different section. Because in Ocarina of Time, the desert is in the West, but in this game, it's in the east.
Still in the West. Remember, the Wii version is reversed.
Yeah I have wondered where they were in the game, for a while I thought maybe they were the Twili and became them as punishment from the Goddesses for following Ganondorf but I do not think that is the case. I am sure they are still around but probably in hiding.
I agree with bgrugby in that I think they're hiding... they resurface in one of the Four Swords games, I believe. Can't remember which at the moment. They're just either ashamed or embarassed at the fact that they really blindly followed Ganondorf as an entire community, and disappeared pretty far into the desert to remove themselves from further damage. And Telma's definitely got some Gerudo blood going on, so they at least were around about 30-40 years before Twilight Princess. Actually, when I got into Gerudo Desert, I kind of thought they built Arbiter's Grounds as penance for generally raising and aiding Ganondorf, and they would staff it themselves, but no go. Shame, really.
1. The Gerudo are named after the desert and not the other way around. Even if they, the geldman and the geldarm would disappear (didn't saw those in the game either), it's still Gerudo Desert. Much like Lake Hylia where usually only one Hylian lives.
2. Please note that it is the GC version that has the correct map. Gerudo Desert is only a bit more to the north (at least, I think the Gerudo Fortress was located more southern).
3. I'm pretty sure they are still around. I don't believe the whole split timeline theory or the alternative universe theory, so I'd say it's pretty important they were featured in FSA.
4. I tend to think Arbiter's Ground indeed is built by them. It is remarkably similar to the Spirit Temple.
5. Why do people (in general) keep assuming that if one or more games don't feature a certain race, the race is most likely dead? I didn't see any Green Chu-Chu is TP, but I highly doubt they really didn't exist. Do I have to assume the Moblin race died out in TP? Or the Kokiri? Is there really no possibility that the Rito already are around? Or that the Oocca didn't exist in OOT?
I agree whole heartedly. :D The Oocca were said to have created the Hylians, so they must have existed long before TP. And one race I'm not quite sure of are the Zuna tribe. They've only appeared in one game so far. And there is one gerudpo in TP, the evil King. In fact, i think it stated that Ganondorf actually slaughtered all of his tribe in a mad quest for power. I'll have to review that.
Please do so, because I can't remember such a thing. It also seems a little odd, considering how proud Ganondorf seems to be of his race (well, if I would be the cause of the destruction of my tribe, I would definetely stop wearing clothes with references to them.)
I think there's a reference in one manual or another that upon reaching the Sacred Realm, Ganondorf's crew began fighting amongst themselves for the Triforce, and at the end, Ganondorf was the winner- and lone survivor. His crew would be made up of a lot of Gerudo so... but I don't think he slaughtered them all- how do they end up in Four Swords Adventure, then? And his evil-doing started with a simple wish: his people to live in a better place. He cared about them in the beginning.
ALTTP I assume. I don't know, they don't have to be the Gerudo. He has commanded several races.
*checking Zeldalegends translation comparision article*
Hmm, okay. Does sound like them, though the Gerudo aren't "evil". Most Goblins seem perfectly capable of being the thieves spoken of.
BTW. Is it me, or does this quote sound very familiar:
"If thou hast a desire, then I shall desire it as well."
SPOILER
that is what Ganondorf told Zant, wasn't it? I'm not there, but my cousin is..
Yep.
Well, according to this: http://www.zeldalegends.net/files/text/z3translation/z3_manual_story.html
it's also what the Triforce once "said" to Ganondorf.
To LadyNintendo:
The Desert is more southern, and the Foretress north. I'm sure they are around, I just didn't know if you could find one. TP comes after OOT (TP comes after TWW, which is after OOT), and that desert was the Haunted Wasteland and the Desert Colossus. The Desert must be named after the Gerudo, because the Gerudo already had a name that I don't think meaned anything. Also, none of you have even considered the possibility that FSA came before, and the Gerudo died prior.
Also, there's this circle space on my map just a molecule north of Arbiter's. What's there?
Kabuto Yakushi: Then again, that all depends on your idea of the series timeline. I place Twilight Princess after Ocarina of Time due to the fact that the maps are overwhelmingly similar, and Wind Waker basically "resets" the maps (what with giant flood and all), creating Old Hyrule (Ocarina of Time and Twilight Princess) and New Hyrule (A Link to the Past and other similar games; Link and Tetra discover this new Hyrule sometime after Wind Waker). Four Swords Adventure, as the sequel to Four Swords, is set in Old Hyrule, due to those games being designed around the port of A Link to the Past. This places Four Swords Adventure after Twilight Princess. This is what I go off of with my theories. I'd be interested to hear the reasoning of a theory that places Four Swords Adventure before Twilight Princess- it would take a good deal of analyzing, but would be very interesting.
I am dangerously skidding off topic and into timeline theorizing! Back to business.
LadyNintendo, I think there were goblins and various sundry creatures among Ganondorf's crew, but it's not entirely far-fetched some Gerudo are still following him around that time.
And I don't think the Gerudo ever die out (within the games released). Zelda deserts are huge, and we're not even going off the gameplay maps. Since Four Swords Adventure places Gerudo in New Hyrule, they could have retreated further into the desert, or even left Hyrule altogether- perhaps settling in Calatia or a country unknown to us.
And I'm just thinking here, but it wouldn't it be awesome if the Gerudo showed up as pirates in Phantom Hourglass? Thieves to pirates isn't that big of a difference (add water and boats), and Phantom Hourglass is covering new areas of the Great Sea, where they could have been during Wind Waker...
Well, Eralk, The Gerudo actually were pirates in majora's mask. I thought that was cool as well. And Lady nintendo, i dont know why, but whenever you respond to something i wrote, you seem to know it all. That kind of angers me. But I digress. We need Shiggy Miamoto up in here. ^_-
Eralk Fang > Before I write anything else, I'd like to let you know it's Four Swords Adventures, not Four Swords Adventure. :)
*checks map of OOT*
Okay, proof I don't know it all. I thought OOT's desert was way more to the south. Silly me. Sorry for that. Still can picture them living in a part of the desert not accesible in TP.
I doubt the desert is named after the Gerudo. I already mentioned the geldman and the geldarm. "Geld" is another way of translating "Gerudo". Looks more like whatever lives in the desert is named after the desert, although it is possible the Gerudo named if after them, and then other people named the monsters living in the desert after the desert.
Though I stick with a single timeline, I kinda temporarily gave up figuring out what games comes when in the timeline. Why? Because too much is possible. Yes, FSA can come before TP (at least, it's 8 o'clock in the morning and my brain right now can't think of any reason why it couldn't come before TP). Heck, if you believe the split timeline theory, you can also argue they are not from the same timeline. It just proves that just because you don't see a certain race for awhile, that doesn't mean they don't exist anymore. (All I can say for now is that if FSA comes before TP, I'm not happy with the fact Ganondorf used a sword (*yawn*) instead of that cool new magical Trident he found in FSA).
I still think it would be hilarious if NIntendo doesn't have it in a timeline, and there's no explanation, they just make the games and laugh at us going crazy over hidden themes that aren't there...
There is supposedly a master timeline in the recesses of Miyamoto's files, but I don't think we're going to see it anytime soon!
Oops, LadyNintendo. I have been super tired recently.
Eralk, you forgot Nintendo has said TP comes after TWW. Also, the Four Swords, if they are based around the LTTP map, would have to be in New Hrule, not old Hyrule. Also, this should be a simple timeline, containing only the major games:
OOT - TWW and PH - TP - LTTP - LOZ and AOL.
Also, the Four Swords are probably next to LTTP, most likely before. Minish Cap probably comes after TP, it's just a hunch. LA would be around LTTP, because, since the Final Nightmare takes the form of Agnahim and Ganon, using their same LTTP strategies. The Oracles are the only one that puzzles me. I think they would be after TWW and PH, and before LOZ and AOL, but where exactly I can only guess. They probably aren't near LTTP and LA, either, since the Final Nightmare could have taken Twinrova's form (more powerful than some of the other forms it became), so I place them at MC, especially since the Oracles are seen there almost exactly as how they were in the Oralce series. So this is my timeline:
OOT - TWW and PH - TP - MC and Oracles - FS series, LTTP, and LA - LOZ and Aol.
And I never said FSA is before TP, I only said none of you are considering the possibility.
Also, you forgot to answer my question on what is in that circle thing!
So because they look tha same and seem to be the same person, you think the Oracles in TMC and OOx are the same? Let's see what that means for all games that feature Malon.... (yep, little bit of sarcasm.....Not saying your timeline is incorrect!)
I'd answer what's in the circle if I'd knew what you're talking about. I don't recall any circle, and I haven't had the time to check yet.
Nintendo says a lot. Besides, I recall that was a mistranslation of the interview and that it has been several times stated TP happens before TWW. Again, I couldn't care less because they claim way too much.
Anyway, some supporters of the split timeline have placed TP as the next adventure in the young Link timeline. Considering the end of OOT, that is possible. However, I say that if Link indeed was brought back before getting the Master Sword, it'd only make sense he'd be brought back just before getting the MS and just after getting the stones (otherwise, he'd be locked up and even more of his actions would never have happened, thus bringing a lot of people in danger again). But, I'm pretty sure Ganon would've killed him then, considering he was following Link.
Anyway, I think you can make tons of timeline theories by using the "evidence" you want to use (using all = no timeline). However, we have a timeline section for that.
as soon as I am at my Mom,s I wil investigate the circle thing...also, the oracles probably aren't the same, think about how many Links and Zeldas there are....
I found out. It's the Coliseumn (spelling wrong) thing where the Twilight Mirror used to be.
And LadyNintendo, I was only proving a point to Eralk Fang, who also posted a timeline here. And if you want to create a timeline and post it on the Timeline section, you can. Don't take this offensively.
I personally don't feel comfortable about putting games like ALttP and TP after TWW until Nintendo release a game that connects to the aftermath of TWW and gives me a reason to put ALttP and TP after TWW.
Of course, it's not impossible that the guy who teach you the Hidden Skills in TP is the Hero of Wind (the way he talks about the green tunics seems as if it was already a tradition at his time), but I still think it's the Hero of Time.
There are many different timelines out there, and thinking about what happens between games often depends on which one you use. Ah, theorizing. Kabuto Yakushi, thank you for explaining your timeline to me, but I should have asked you to send me a PM. Sorry. I think the main timeline thing that's relevant to this thread is that Ocarina of Time comes before Twilight Princess.
To get back to the Gerudo (or lack thereof) in Twilight Princess: What are your thoughts on Telma and her ancestry?
In Ocarina of Time, a Gossip Stone will tell you that Gerudos come to the Castle Town to find mates. I've heard that Gerudo will return a son from such a union to his father or kill it, but couldn't find anything about it in an Ocarina of Time text dump, so it may be a piece of fanon. There's at least some Hylian blood in the Gerudos of Ocarina of Time if the information got into a Gossip Stone, but they still retain the traditional Gerudo look: red hair, prominent noses, tan skin, and rounded ears. The Gerudo genetics are bizarrely super dominant. Now, if you show Talon the Gerudo Mask, he comments that the mask resembles Malon's mother. If her mother was Gerudo, then Malon was left behind at the ranch, probably due to the fact she looked more Hylian than Gerudo, her ears in particular. So the dominance of "true" Gerudo traits are starting to wane in the genetics of the Gerudo during Ocarina of Time, if we believe Talon that Malon's mother is Gerudo.
Fast forward to Twilight Princess. No Gerudo to be seen, save Ganondorf himself, but Telma has a few of the traits. She's tan and redheaded, but her pointy ears give her away as a Hylian. It's plausible to say that by this point, Gerudo genetics are no longer as super dominant as they once were, and Telma's got some Gerudo in her background- how close the connection, we don't know.
An extreme one could conclude from this is that the Gerudo have basically... diffused. Always dependent on Hylian mates, and perhaps... "removing" baby Gerudo boys, rare as they are, due to the evil Ganondorf has brought about (trying to avoid another repeat), the Gerudo of Ocarina of Time are no more (well, except for Ganondorf). Instead, the Gerudo move to the cities, take Hylian and human mates, and you end up with people like Telma being the closest thing to a "classic" Ocarina of Time Gerudo you can get.
I do think that's very extreme, and don't think that's the case, but I also think it's an interesting thing to "what if" about.
What do you guys think- either about the extreme or Telma's ancestry?
Okay, now this goes into Theories.
I believe that it is most likely a coincidence that Telma and Din look like Gerudo. Din is reasonable, she is motly in the sun, therefore gaining a tan. Plus, we've seen Asian, European/North American, and African originated poeple throughout the Zelda series. It's possible Native Amerian could also be there. Or mabye Latin Americans.
Din is not a coincidence. Her physical look is SUPOSSED to resemble the Goddess.
Anyway, going by Eralk Fang's theory, I'm starting to think that maybe FSA fits better before TP, and therefore the 'execution' of Ganon has nothing to do with OoT. And what happens with Ganon in FSA do fit the description Eralk Fang gave. Ganon is chased into the desert because he's evil.
Now I'm also starting to believe that maybe OoT isn't the Seal War. It still fits with the Japanese version of the legend, but I now believe it's after FSA and a few centuries before TP and that after the Sages sealed off the 'source of evil' and Ganon was defeated he was brought to the Mirror Chamber to face execution.
This will create some holes in the timeline, but if this theory is correct they are likely to be filled sooner or later.
Well, my guess is that FSA is between OOT and TP, and that the desert was renamed because the Gerudo got tired of Ganon and joined Hyrule's side. In revenge, Ganon massacred them all once free.
Also, this brings a few mysteries. Where does LTTP fit in. This mystery began once TWW came out, and now it is worse with TP out. How could Ganon be reborn after he died? (If my guess leads to him dying at the end) What connection between those two mirrors is there? What is the Orcarina/Flute in LTTP? Why does the map always get scrambled up to make it even worse?
Why did Ganon bother doing the same things he did to the Zora's in OOT, knowing it would fail? Is there really a game before OOT? What role do the Zunas later play? Why do the the things in Dark World LTTP say they are from the OOT war against Ganon if they don't appear in the Twilight Realm and the Dark Realm are the same? Why does all this make my head spin?
Well I assume it's the same desert, in arbiter grounds theres a gerudo statue with a snake wrapped around it that is almost identical to the one in the spirit temple. I assume that it became a prison/death house later on when they stored all sorts of criminals in there.