The Temple of Time (spoilers maybe)

[Commodore Axilon]

Was it not stated in the game, by Ooccoo I believe, that the Temple of Time was built by the Oocca? The Oocca are a very ancient race probably accounting for the Temple's ruined state in TP.  So perhaps that Temple of Time was the original Temple of Time and another was built for whatever reason.  Though that doesn't really explain why the Master Sword is there, or why you need it to access the temple...

...Unless it was originally there, moved to the Temple of Time 2, then moved back to the original ToT.  Improbable, I know, but it's only a theory.

This of course only makes sense(kind of) if you assume the ToT in TP is not the same as the ToT in OoT, which is a  fairly reasonable assumption to make considering they look nothing alike. Well, not really nothing alike, but they're clearly not the same Temple.

(First post! w00t w00t!)

[Eralk Fang]

Hmm. Interesting idea, Commander Axilon, that they're not the same temple. I myself think they are, but interesting nonetheless.

I don't recall that Ooccoo ever mentioning that, but no script or text dump is available for Twilight Princess right now, so I can't go and check. And they have their own sky city, so why build down in Hyrule? But that does bring up an interesting idea- the Oocca need a Temple of Time to house their relics, and the Hylians come up with the same idea to guard a way into the Sacred Realm. Some kind of connection, as the Oocca supposedly made the Hylians.

And hey, welcome! I'm fairly new myself.

[Evahn]

She doesn't say the temple was built by the Oocca, but that the temple holds Ooccan technology, aka the Rod of Dominion.

Though I could be wrong ...

[LadyNintendo]

The DR's theirs, the ToT not.

I'd be somewhat surprised if the ToT was built by the Oocca. I don't even believe they built the City in the Sky. They may have created nice magic(al items), but that doesn't mean they can build proper buildings.

[Eralk Fang]

There is that part where they don't have thumbs...

LadyNintendo, I find that idea very interesting- I can certainly see them just inhabiting the (very nice) ruins of someone else's city. But that begs the question- who built the City in the Sky? Did the Ooccoo create the Dominion Rod themselves or merely enchant a rod they found? And how did the Dominion Rod find its way into the Temple of Time? I really need to go back and play through Twilight Princess again, but I only recall Ooccoo saying it had been lost, and she did not elaborate on it.

Answered my own question. From Alpha's latest post:

According to Sheikah legends, there is a tale of when the Oocca still kept in contact with the Hylian Royal Family. The Dominion Rod was given to the people, and was only to be carried by the messenger of the heavens when the Royal Family needed to communicate with the Oocca. The Sheikah have guarded a book that was to be given to the messenger, and Impaz is happy to finally fulfill her tribe's mission by granting you the Ancient Sky Book.

watch double posting Eralk. You can modify your post with the "modify" botton along the top of your post space.

[Evahn]

That brings up something else. Were the Oocca still in contact with the Royal Family during OoT?

[Commodore Axilon]

Well I could be wrong, but I vaguely recall something like that. I t could have just been the Dominion Rod though.

Tell me, Eralk Fang, why do you think the TP Temple of Time is the same as the OoT Temple of Time?  The entrance looks a little similar yes, but there's the fact that the one in OoT wasn't eight stories tall.

And about the Oocca not having thumbs. Perhaps that's why they needed the Dominion Rod. They used statues to do all the building and what not. This is assuming of course that the Dominion Rod in the ToT isn't the only one.

[Evahn]

A good theory you bring up about the Dominion Rod, Axilon.


But about the TP ToT not being OoT's ToT; why do you think the TP Hyrule is the same as the OoT Hyrule? The areas are named similarily yes, but there's the fact that the one in OoT wasn't as big.

The reason I think it's the same temple is because it has the same name, the Master Sword was there, and because the music from the entrance (not the dungeon area) is taken directly from OoT.

[Commodore Axilon]

Why do you think that the area in OoT was the entire country of Hyrule? It's far too small and underpopulated to be a functioning kingdom. The Kingdom of Hyrule probably extends far beyond the in-game map, and this goes for virtually all the Zelda games.

And about the Temple of Time: The fact that one was eight stories high and the other wasn't doesn't say anything to you?

Edit: And music? Big whoop. The music in the TP Hyrule Castle is the same as the music from the TWW Hyrule Castle, which is the same as the music from the ALttP Hyrule Castle. And you're not gonna tell me they're all the same castle, are you? Music only means it's somewhat related, in this case: they're both named the Temple of Time, and they both hold the Master Sword.

Edit2: The Master Sword has been in a different place in every other Zelda game, what makes you think it's any different here?

And finally the name: many places have had the same name in the games. Let's see: Hyrule Castle, Death Mountain, Lon Lon Ranch, Zora's Domain, Hyrule Field, The Lost Woods, Ganon's Tower, Kakariko Village, etc., etc.. So I hardly see how that helps your point.

[Evahn]

Touché.

And the music thing, my point was that those other ones are the same songs, but the ToT has the same, er, recording, if you will. Like, they made absolutely no changes to it. The other songs have instrument changes and such between each game, but the ToT music is exact.

I'm not sure why I was defending that point anyways, because it's not likely to be the same temple. A building like that couldn't be moved that far, even if the eight story part was built afterward. I guess I just liked the idea of it being the same place.

I believe it was rebuilt in the woods after Ganon was defeated in OoT.

[Commodore Axilon]

And the music from Ganondorf's escape attempt from the Arbiter's Grounds in TP is exactly the same as the music from the collapse of Ganon's Tower in OoT. I don't mean the same song either, they were identical. And the only thing they had in common was Ganondorf doing...something...evil. So that doesn't help your point either.

And why should the ToT have had to have been rebuilt? It wasn't destroyed.

Since I think TP must have been at least 300 years after OoT, is that enough time for a giant building like that to completely fall apart?

[Evahn]

I know, but that one was still updated ... The ToT music sounded to me like ... like they just copied the music file from an OoT rom and put it in TP, or something. I don't know ...

What happened to the old temple if wasn't torn down or destroyed?

[Eralk Fang]

Commander Axilon, the music in several of these examples has a purpose. In the castle music, it's to establish you are in the Royal Castle- no matter which one it is. However, there is no generic temple music to establish you are in a temple, no matter what temple it is. Each has their specific theme, usually established in Ocarina of Time. The Temple of Time's theme is very distinct, and I don't think it was even rearranged for Twilight Princess. While this really doesn't mean a thing in proving they are the same, most people's gut reaction when they enter Twilight Princess' Temple of Time is a memory of Ocarina of Time's Temple of Time, whether right or not.

But I had a thought on that. The Time Door doesn't have to take Link back to the time of Ocarina of Time. It could take him further back, to when it was first built, before the Link of Ocarina of Time visited it, or any time between the ending of Ocarina of Time and Twilight Princess. At one point, it could have been eight stories tall, probably to show off the fact the Hylians had a portal to the Sacred Realm, and everybody else didn't, neener neener neener (and did we mention the mystical bird people are talking to us?). And then seven were knocked off at any point.

[Evahn]

The Temple of Time's theme is very distinct, and I don't think it was even rearranged for Twilight Princess. While this really doesn't mean a thing in proving they are the same, most people's gut reaction when they enter Twilight Princess' Temple of Time is a memory of Ocarina of Time's Temple of Time, whether right or not.

That's pretty much what I was trying to say.

Hmmm ... I wonder how far back the door to the past sends you?

And what are those other ruins around the temple in the present?

Gwah ... so many questions ...

[Commodore Axilon]

I know, but that one was still updated ... The ToT music sounded to me like ... like they just copied the music file from an OoT rom and put it in TP, or something. I don't know ...

No, it was the exact same music same as the ToT. Maybe they were just lazy and used the same music files, who knows? But it still doesn't prove they're the same temple.

What happened to the old temple if wasn't torn down or destroyed?

Uh, it's still there?